Lose hose

[Ernest]

 

Hi

I am experiencing a problem with a rubber hose that keeps coming off when out driving - result being very hot water on my foot, temp raised and quite a bit of steam coming from under the bonnet.

It is the connection where a heater hose pushes onto a protruding bit of pipe attached to the bulkhead. It is the length of black pipe underneath another green pipe of the heater. Between the battery and the clutch master cylinder.

I think that both pipes are part of the heater system. 

Anyway, it seems that however tight I screw up the circlip the pipe comes of. I don't think that the circlip is slipping and it was holding the old pipe on fine - the old pipe had a pinhole leak, hence the new pipe.

Any ideas on how to make a secure attachment would be appreciated.

Ernest

 

 

[RogerH]

Hi Ernest,

Remove the offending pipe and see if there is a ridge on the bulkhead adaptor.

If it is just plain pipe then that is the problem. There needs to be a swagged  ridge so the jubilee clip has something to grip against.

Have a look at the link. You will see the swagged ridge on thecurved pipes but none on the straight pipes - that is not good. Bulkhead

Have you tries a new smaller  jubilee clip.   If you can get a Mikalor clip they work better.

 

Roger

[Nigel C]

Have to say I bought myself a water system pressure tester kit. Comes in a carry case, costs about £50. Its great for testing the system whilst the engine isn't running, hot or cold you find leaks so much easier and you can slightly over pressurise the system to check.

These sort of things I buy 50/50 with my next door neighbour as they're "once in a blue moon use" and as he says, as he's 80 years old hopefully I'll inherit and not the other way round!

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/386747797798?var=0&mkevt=1&mkcid=1&mkrid=710-53481-19255-0&campid=5338590836&toolid=10044&loc_physical_ms=41840&customid=876c8abd6a2413ea3c65e318a14244f5&gclid=876c8abd6a2413ea3c65e318a14244f5

 

Edited Monday at 05:46 PM by Nigel C

[Malbaby]

I presume you have the twin pipe bulkhead fitting for the heater.....And you fitted a new one...Now one hose fits ok, but the other not....How tight/loose is the current hose on the pipe?...Are both hoses the same diameter?

[Z320]

Hi Ernest,

due to Roger‘s link the bulkhead connecors have a ridge on only one side —>  IMO it should work without.

The new hoses must fit TIGH already without a clip or wire on whatever pipe.

The best ones you have to put in hot water to get them soft and elastic before you can manage to fit them.

Fitted, but without clip it must be difficult to pull them off again.

They must be made from vulcanized rubber, not plastic / PVC.

Perhaps you can show us photos?

Ciao, Marco

[Schnippel]

Hello,

The new bulkhead connections don't have proper crimped edges on the pipe ends. The stainless steel return pipes from the radiator are also faulty. It's highly recommended to have this done by a professional! This is shoddy workmanship from the start! I know a woman who scalded her entire foot with hot coolant.

Regards, Ralf

[Ernest]

Thanks all for the suggestions/feedback. I am going to try again this today - using two new circlips! 

The old circlip plus has held the pipe on without any problem for at least the eight years that I have owned the car.

So difficult to see why it is slipping off. I bought the new pipe from Rimmers. I am tempted to refit the old one and

just tape up the pinhole leak.

Thanks again

Ernest

[Mike C]

Once corrosion starts pinhole leaks they will just keep reappearing unless you can kill the rust and seal the pipes internally.

Are the outside diameters of the old and new pipes the same?

[BlueTR3A-5EKT]

Did you get sucked into silicone hoses?

My experience with them was the same outcome as you are experiencing.  I could not get them to seal as they were not a tight fit on the bulkhead tube connector. (Thank you Marco)

Fixed it by swaging the end of the bulkhead tube connector and reverting to EPDM reinforced rubber type hoses, which were a tight push fit before securing with a clip.  

Worst offending hose was the radiator to thermostat housing hose in blue silicone.  It wobbled when fitted on the tubes at each end, and simply could not be clamped tight.   This event  caused  me to project lead the remaking of the original stockinette covered top hoses for TR2-4A in EPDM from the original factory drawing.     Other ones on the market at the time were silicone (too large) or plain rubber from Pakistani etc being too long or not reinforced.

[TR graham2]

Use wire type clips , standard jubilee do not work on that hose for some reason 

[RogerH]

The higher point pressure from the wire diameter (smaller area) grips better than the larger area that the jubillee clip has.

But it still needs a swagged end.

 

Roger

[Ernest]

Hi all

Apologies for my ignorance Roger, but what does 'swagged end' mean? Not sure what a type of 'wire-clip' is. Is this a term for a specific type of clip?

My attempt today to use two new circlips was pretty much a complete failure - halfway round a short block and left foot soaked in very hot water.

The old and new hoses are rubber with wire reinforced inner lining. I bought the new one from Moss nor Rimmers as I noted earlier.

Thanks again all for advise so far.

Ernest 

[RogerH]

Hi Ernest

this is a wire clip. The wire has a smaller foot print so applies more pressure between the rubber hose and the pipe
https://www.moss-europe.co.uk/en-gb/wire-clip-hose-clamping-wire-type-5-3-8-7-3-3-4-7-cs4012

Have a look here at the bulkhead fitting. behind the bulkhead the two pipes have swagged bodies. The pipe in front of the 
bulkhead is completely parallel
https://www.moss-europe.co.uk/en-gb/connection-bulkhead-heater-hoses-stainless-steel-611043ss

 

Roger

[Ernest]

Thanks very much Roger. That's really helpful.

Ernest

[Peter V W]

Looks as if an original one is only swagged at one end.

Picture from eBay advert.

Edited Tuesday at 04:44 PM by Peter V W
E

[stuart]

13 minutes ago, Peter V W said:

Looks as if an original one is only swagged at one end.

Picture from eBay advert.

Thats correct they were only swaged on one side and being in mild steel they rot for a past time.

Stuart.

[Ernest]

Blimey Peter that does look like it has seen a bit of service!

Mine is shiny and new looking - and hence very slippery.

I have just sent for the clips that Roger suggested and am hoping these might hold the hose on.

Failing this I am at loss.     Superglue?

Ernest

[Z320]

13 hours ago, Peter V W said:

Looks as if an original one is only swagged at one end.

Picture from eBay advert.

Hi Peter,

thank you for having doubt too and posting the photo.

I'm pretty sure this is obvious considering how this "unit" must be produced to be cheap:

cut the pipes, press the ridge end in one side, bend the pipes, stick them through with the therefore not ridged end, weld them in position...

And now the unit is too complicated and to fragile to hold and press a ridge on the other end of the pipes and keep them low price.

And there are other connections on our TRs without a ridge end too:

- TR2-4 water pump housing, bypass connection

- TR2-4 thermostat housing, bypass connection

- petrol hose to steel pipes and petrol hose to float chamber lid

The most important issue to get a hose connection sealed is the tight fit on the pipe without a clip.

If this is not the case the clip will not seal the connection. Guess why I know.

Ciao, Marco 

Edited Wednesday at 06:38 AM by Z320

[Z320]

22 minutes ago, Ernest said:

Blimey Peter that does look like it has seen a bit of service!

Mine is shiny and new looking - and hence very slippery.

I have just sent for the clips that Roger suggested and am hoping these might hold the hose on.

Failing this I am at loss.     Superglue?

Ernest

Do the hoses fit tight on the pipes?

If not, scrap them and buy new ones.

[NigelC]

Ernest, what pressure cap are you running and does it work properly?

 

 

[Motorsport Mickey]

Err…maybe a way of ADDING the swage to the parallel pipe on the inside might help ?
 

How about soldering a suitable olive onto the pipe at the end ? Or failing finding a suitable olive a wrap of steel material of 1mm thickness ( whatever you can work) and 3 or 4 mm wide cut to length and formed around a drill shank of suitable dia to a round shape and then solder that onto the parallel shaft pipe ? Think you’ll find then even the standard clips will work.

Mick Richards.

Edited Wednesday at 09:34 AM by Motorsport Mickey

[Z320]

When I wanted to make it extra good (not a TR) I soldered 1 ring of 1 mm wire on it.

[RogerH]

12 minutes ago, Z320 said:

When I wanted to make it extra good (not a TR) I soldered 1 ring of 1 mm wire on it.

+1

and yes you can solder Stainless Steel.

 

Roger

[Ernest]

Hi all

 

Thanks very much for ongoing advise.

The new rubber hose does fit the section of metal pipe quite tightly even before the clips are tightened. But a few hundred 

yards down the road and it slips off.

I don't know what you mean by a 'pressure cap' Nigel, sorry. But bear in mind that the old pipe worked

fine for the past eight years so presumably any 'pressure' would have been 

acceptable.

I will have think about the advise - Thanks again, I very much appreciate the attempts to help.

Ernest

[stuart]

6 minutes ago, Ernest said:

Hi all

 

Thanks very much for ongoing advise.

The new rubber hose does fit the section of metal pipe quite tightly even before the clips are tightened. But a few hundred 

yards down the road and it slips off.

I don't know what you mean by a 'pressure cap' Nigel, sorry. But bear in mind that the old pipe worked

fine for the past eight years so presumably any 'pressure' would have been 

acceptable.

I will have think about the advise - Thanks again, I very much appreciate the attempts to help.

Ernest

Reference to pressure cap means the radiator cap pressure rating.

Stuart.